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I believe grief drove my mother into depression that exacerbated the onset of dementia. She has lost over 70lbs, will only eat yogurt, lays on the couch all day, no self care, refused to leave the house, has become aggressive with me, her memory is exponentially worse, she believes people are out to get her, she says horrible things about herself, It can take hours to get her to pay just a fraction of her bills, she is not the person I know, I have tried calling agencies and am getting nowhere. If she were a child I could take her to the doctors against her will. As an adult it would be considered abuse because it would be against her will kicking and screaming. She feels I am "in on it and "know what going on around here". She is 76 and worked up until this all started, the death of her close sister and of my brother. in less than 1 year she has become this person who needs help to care for herself. I have been with her for 6 months and have not made any progress and gained no resources for assistance. I have asked her for power of attorney to assist her in bill payment and food shopping. She forgets passwords ever when she saves them in her password keeper. She is suspicious of everyone. It's a very long story best told by mouth than on paper but ultimately I don't know what to do. I want her to live with me. I am from out of state and have left my family. I can't stay here forever. I need her to live with me or things set up so she can live at home with aids and etc but I can't get anything in place with none of her information, no legal control, hipaa laws. Had anyone been in my shoes? What did you do? What do I do?

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Well--I wouldn't take her in to live with me. At first blush, that seems 'wisest' but she will bring all this misery to your home and you don't need that.

You have moved away from your home to take care of her? And she's not responding?

Do you have sibs who are supportive or are you all alone in this?

Since she's not respecting YOU, maybe you might as well set up in home CG for her and go back home, keeping in touch with the CG's.

Call a CG agency and get more info. You can probably do more than you think.

In the meantime--good luck. This is no darn fun, is it?
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Without diagnosis this won't happen.
And if you have "left the family" and your mom doesn't trust you, this won't happen.
Speaking of having left the family: who is there with Mom and do they agree with you?
Is the family united that this is looking like dementia? Because from your description it could as easily be mental illness or deep depression brought on by grief.
From your post I think your mom has made it clear she doesn't want your help. You have also told us you don't live there and there is other family there. Are they more familiar with mom and what do they think?
You don't say what agencies you have tried. Have you asked APS for a wellness check telling them your mom seems in danger to you? Asking for an assessment?
Have you asked her doctor how best to proceed?
And again, have you discussed with your family.
Long and short of what you need to know is that the courts of our land will NOT take a citizen's rights from him or her without solid reason this must be done for his or her own safety. That means you would need full physical and neurological workup to present to the courts, and if your mom wished her own attorney to fight your asking for conservatorship, that would be provided to her and she would likely win after you paid your lawyer a minimum of 10,000.00. It isn't against the laws of the land to be depressed and angry and slow to pay bills.
So basically, on the basis only of what you have told us, no wandering, no getting lost out there and family being contacted by police, no setting house on fire with stove, you don't have anything solid to present to MDs or to courts.
Why in the WORLD you would want to move a demented senior who is paranoid about you into your own home a world away from her home and family? That makes me question your foundation in a way to approach and intent to proceed. Have you any idea at all what this would require of you?
Before you leave to go back home speak with the family who is there about ways they can check up on your mom. Form a good phone tree to speak with them. Keep checking in with them.
Best of luck.
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You have a tough situation. If she has not officially been diagnosed as having dementia she can still legally sign a Power of Attorney (POA). This has to be done with a notary public present. But, if she doesn't trust you that might prove difficult. I suspect this eventually will mean a trip to the ER where she will be so diagnosed and you can get a lawyer to have a judge appoint you as guardian. Good luck.
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Just because you are a nurse doesn't mean it's the best thing for YOU to be your mother's 24/7/365 caregiving slave.

Look at how stressed you are now -- do you have any idea what it would be like if she moved in? Why would you put your family through that? Why would you put yourself through that?

It sounds like your mother needs to be in a facility.
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I have not read the responses but this worked for me... I told my Daddy that he ran out of his prescription and we need to go to the doctor to refill it. OOOH that got him in the car fast. And when I set up the appointment I told the receptionist that I needed to talk to the doctor BEFORE my Daddy. The doctor and I talked about the situation at home and since he was a geriatric doctor he understood. So fast forward to my daddys turn at the appointment the doctor told him what needed to be done and I just repeated what the doctor said when a situation would develop. Also, it sounds as if your mom may have a UTI. UTI's in an elderly person affects them differently than someone younger than 60. If she is accusing you of being against her in some way, IMO she has a UTI. Your mom might need anti-depressant meds due to the loss of her family, my brother did after his divorce. Also, to get guardianship you will need two doctors diagnosis of mental disability and go to court. You can make an appointment to see an elderly attorney for that kind of legal advise (which by the way was worth the money for me). Please note that this is my experience. Hugs and blessings
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I’ve no instructions on how to get her help. All I can say is do not bring her to live with you! You think it’s bad now? Just wait!
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Can you tell her that since it is a "new year" that Medicare requires her to have an "Annual Wellness Check" in order to keep her health insurance valid?
If this works you will at least get her to the doctor.
How "aggressive" does she get with you? Is it enough that you think she might possibly harm you? If so you can use that to call 911 and say that you are afraid for your safety. Officers responding my decide to transport her to the hospital. Although she might refuse you can then ask that she be transported to "jail". I am sure at that point an evaluation would be ordered.
I strongly advise you to think twice about bringing her to your house to live. If she is diagnosed with dementia it is not easy caring for someone and if she is aggressive it can be worse and possibly dangerous for you.
Application for Medicaid if she has limited funds would be the place to start.

Once you have a diagnosis of dementia then you see an attorney, preferably an Elder Care Attorney and you can seek Guardianship at that point. And Guardianship is not easy nor is it inexpensive.
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If something happens, she needs hospitalization, anything can happen. Without POA the state will take control of her and her assets. Would she rather that than you?

I wonder if she may have a UTI.
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Stop asking, stop arguing, just start doing. You can legally give info to her doctor, if she has one. Send them a detailed letter, follow-up with a phone call. Even if it's a UTI, that's probably not the only factor.

She may be on too much medication, or combos of meds that don't interact well. She may be taking the wrong dosages, or skipping them. Meds have severe mental side effects, especially benzodiazepines.

Snoop in her bathroom and bedroom, looking for pill bottles. She might have several practitioners who don't know each other, who are prescribing the same medications.

Start with investigating UTI and a medication review. Yes, you must trick her into a doctor visit, as others have suggested. Is a home visit from a medical practitioner possible? If worst comes to worst, can she pee in a cup at home and someone from the testing lab comes to pick it up?
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There are private services that provide geriatric care managers. Usually someone with a combo of medical or social work experience with elderly. They cost $$, but they can help you understand what you CAN do, and what options you DO have.

Remember that attorneys have one idealized view of the world, where no one can be forced to do anything unless they are declared incompetent.

But in the real life of elderly dementia care and even geriatric psychiatry, there is often a wide gray area in which practitioners will take action that you request, if your mother is clearly not in her right mind and your mother has no ability to go against it.

For example, if she has no ability to make a coherent phone call, or has no ability to drive to the bank and take out her own money, it might be easier than you think to trick her into locked memory care, and they might even accept her in locked memory care on the condition that you eventually get some legal paperwork together. Laws are different in each state, and you would be surprised.
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Daphne131 Feb 2023
Driving is irrelevant. Driving is it a legal criteria to revoke anyone’s legal rights. Driving is a pro ledge per each state and. It a right. Millions don’t drive and are not suffering from mental impairment. Safety is most important to determine competence but each State is different. Look up Probate Code in State. It lists the only legal requirements of senior competence or incompetence. Competence for making legal decisions is not the same competence needed to engage in a civil contract.

in CA dimentia doesn’t mean you lose all your legal rights. People have right to make own bad decisions even if have dimentia so long as they are not a threat ti themselves or others while residing alone.

Legal competence is CA remain in effective even with mild and moderate dimentia so long as they know who there family is they know their assets, they know nature is will, POA, Trust and they know consequences of their own decisions in wills trusts, POA.

notice this had zero to do with five daily living tasks because there are many people who can’t do daily living tasks but are legally competent like paralyzed people and military men and women.

Each State us different. It’s best to hold off on the POA being activated or effective for your own sanity. To control a Senior has many legal consequences and duties on you as the POA holder. People are often too eager to get control bc they think the senior has memory issues.

so what id senuoe cannot recall date, time, events, what they are, so long as they are acting safe, eating, keep clean home and know who closest care taker family is. This is the modern times and seniors w dimentia stay in their homes much longer thanks to modern conveniences like Alexa, Blink cameras and fact most Te bit a threat to themselves or others in mild to moderate dimentia. Reps t their right to remain in own homes as Memory care and Asst Living retire you be available 24/7 also. It’s not a cure you think it is for yourself.
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Get her to her doctor make something up - speak with the doctor beforehand . Sounds Like she needs assisted Living or memory care . get a social worker to help you navigate the system. I agree with Many People here do not bring her to your home she Probably wouldn't go . Tough situation this is just the beginning . You can go to the bank and Do POA and health care Proxy . ( Paperwork from a lawyer or off the internet )
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You are going to need a doctor to evaluate and document in order to get a judge to approve conservatorship.

Tell her the doctor called and she needs her yearly checkup because of Medicare. Write the dr ahead of time and list all the concerns, much as you have now. Let him know you'd also like to have blood and urinalysis done at the same time you come in for the visit. You need to be sure she doesn't have any bladder infections going on (mental changes caused by that) or other deficiencies that could cause confusion. Include a list of all her meds in the dr letter you write and ask if any of those might cause confusion...or if there is something that could be added to address her depression and lack of life interests.

I never had any problem talking with the doctor with my mother in the room because I spoke up and provided answers to many things he was asking. He knew me from bringing her in all the time, so no one there ever even asked her to sign me as ok for info on any HIPAA form.

As far as bill paying, you can probably do nearly everyone of them via phone call and pay by bank account without involving her. Or next time she forgets a password, you go online and fix it with a password - tell her they are working on it, but took the payment from you. Whatever you have to say to her so she knows the bill is paid and she didn't have to do anything.

Now getting her to leave her home and move with you...that might be a little harder. Guardianship might be the only thing, at this point, where you could make her move in with you...or choose her NH. She may still be good enough in the brain to know she wants to live in her own home.
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Several related points here:

1. If she wrote a Durable Power of Attorney previously you may not need more intensive and expensive conservatorship.

2. If she doesn’t have POA yet that let’s you help her once she is incapacitated, then ask doctor to sign document you write saying she meet Probate Code (in CA) section to still legally make her own decisions. This accomplished two things. One, she can then sign standard State POA to then let you help her AFTER two doctors’ determine she is unable to care for herself or on POA effective date. Then you don’t need conservatorship. If your mother agrees to sign this POA w notary, make certain it is effective immediately if you want to bypass need for two doctors (the law in CA) to have to verify her as unable to care for herself.

3. Ask doctor to sign statement that corresponds with State’s Probate Code definition of competency for legal estate planning which is different than other competencies related to five daily acts of life. Look up law in your State first online.

4. In CA our lawyer gave generic stmt with no letterhead, so one can get doctors signature, “I Dr. _.am a licensed doctor in State of __ and patient ____ had been my patient for more than seven years. Patient knows who her family is, what her assets are (with dimentia they still usually know they own a house or jewelry), know the nature of wills, trusts, Power of Attorney, knows consequences of her own decisions related to these. Signature and date.” Our doctor signs our form each visit.

5. Having dimentia doesn’t automatically mean patient is dimented nor looses all their rights or can’t live alone. Everyone has “right to make own bad decisions” a lawyer told us safety issues what matters most.

6. By getting this document you are also protected from being misaccused of forcing parent to sign POA.

7. POA can be effective either on day you and she signed or by certification of two doctors. Remember, legal duties you have go way up moment POA is effective. If she is that. Then you can wait months and have doctor re-evaluate and verify if doctor feels appropriate to have POA be active for incompetence Or, just make it effective when she signs with notary.

8. If mother still doesn’t do what is safe, take knobs off oven, stove, and knives out of house. Remember, the elderly fall in assisted living also. There is no fully safe place in earth.

9. And remember you still have lots of duties to her and to an assisted living facility if you place her there. Duty to pack up her home and sell is also huge. Is that what you want to do alone? Start it now. Hiring dumpster and more to remove craps when she’s not there to simplify sale and her move yet so she isn’t harmed mentally as much.

10. She will have problems in assisted living probably, bc it’s unfamiliar. You will be contacted anytime by facility to talk her down. So memory care and assisted living isn’t cure-all for your hassles either.

11. Eventually, time will come when moving or calling in palliative or hospice care is inevitable. That’s with severe dimentia. By then she will loose her much of her strong will. It is inevitable. So long as she is not threat to herself or others, can feed, dress, heat up food, not wander off, operate telephone, TV, she might be happier and it might be better to leave her in home and bring in person once or twice week for showering, meal prep, companionship for 4-6 hours so it’s not so financially hardship. Provide puzzle, Blink camera to ensure she is safe that you operate in your Alexa app on your phone. It’s also a backup phone if phone goes out. Amazon Alexa app,

Blink cameras are great for caregivers and patients to remain in home. You can do med reminders, deep breathing, jokes, news, photos, “Drop In” function to chat w parent even control thermostat, lights if you want. It can show you whose coming to front door, and make senior feel like they have a friend.
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From what you describe I don't think I'd think of dementia first, I'd be more concerned about other forms of mental illness. Poor lady, what she's been through. And poor you, what you're going through.

You'd better see if APS offers an advice line in your area, and ask how to get her some form of crisis help in her best interests before she does herself an irreparable damage.

When you say you have left your family, I hope that only means you've left them behind while you deal with this?
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Also, there are often insurance paid traveling nurse. Contact insurance companies social worker to set up. Nurse will give her report to doctor.

And there are traveling attorneys also to get things in order before your parent reaches level of severe dimentia when doctors certify as unable to care for herself.
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There is no cure for dimentia as my Mum’s Doctor in CA said. Her doctor gave her no drugs since there is no cure and memory drugs only delay the inevitable torture longer. Hence, needing a doctor for an incurable illness isn’t always needed. How I’ll it help?

It can’t change the DNA of getting dimentia. It just documents dimentia which make you as Caretaker have a higher level of care depending on severity of dimentia determined.
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Hi there,
I am in a very similar situation with my mom. However, my mom is more agreeable with her care. I’m thinking of what I would do if I were in your situation. If she’s a danger to herself, which is sounds like she is, I would call the crisis team. The crisis team can come and assess her. That could be a start and maybe the crisis team could assist you further.
I hope this helps. Good luck and prayers your way.
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Contact your local Agency of Area on Aging, a Federal agency in every state and found in local County.
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Some things to consider:
1. When she is "sleeping all day, non compliant, etc" consider calling 911 and have her transported to ER.
If they arrive and she is combative with them, this will be more documentation of her needs. Once at ER, have her assessed for " level of care needs" explaining to her that it is for her safety and well being. Confer with social services at ER re options for her continuing care given that you cannot stay.

2. Or, you could call APS ( adult protective services), report her conditions and status in the home, safety concerns, inform that you cannot stay and tell them when you will be leaving.

3. Speak with an Elder Care attorney to clarify your responsibilities, and need for decision making authority etc.

You deserve a life and are graciously offering for her to live with you. Be very certain about this, vs facility placement near you for many reasons. Look at all options.
Do not allow her to hold you hostage to her fears, grief, physical and mental health decline and needs.
Get help ! One way or another..
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tluck8,

I don't respond here often but your question struck a nerve. I also live out of state from my parents who are both struggling. I also do not have POA (make sure this is what you want). My parents also can not handle their finances and while one drinks and has memory and health issues, the other has undiagnosed dementia. Mom is slowly going blind (dad already is) due to their resistance to continue macular degeneration eyeshots to save their vision. I have spoken to a number of lawyers and here is what I think you should know.
Getting guardianship or conservatorship is not easy and it is expensive. In NY which is where my parents live, it begins with a retainer of $7,500. The actual cost can go over $15,000. This is your money. Then you have to understand that you will be totally responsible for your mom. You will have to visit her 4 times annually and imagine how happy she is going to be with you? You have taken away her independence. So most likely you will have flights to pay for and hotel rooms. You will also be preparing an annual report for the court regarding all her finances. If she has slipped up in terms of paying taxes or other bills you will be responsible for fixing these issues (my parents have not paid their taxes in 2 years). You are in a very difficult situation, I know because I live it too.
My advice is what I have been told by many people associated with the elderly. Something bad will happen and then you can hopefully gain some control. Talk to Adult Protective Services in your moms state. See what they can do to help. If you think she has dementia, talk to the Alzheimer's Association. They have a toll free number and they will send you information regarding services. Contact and familiarize yourself with the senior communities near your mom (or near you if you prefer to have her move closer to you). Contact a lawyer in your mom's state and see if they have a free 1/2 hour consult so that you can learn the state's rules for guardianship. Each state is different. You may find you have no control right now. If that is the case, your waiting game has begun.
You would think that APS (adult protective services) would be able to step right in and analyze the situation, but they really often have no control, even when dementia is obvious. The Alzheimers Association may be able to do a home assessment for you, look into that. In essence, what I have found is I have no control over my parents even though they are sick and in need of assistance. It's been 3 years of watching them swirl down the drain and even though the police have been called numerous times and they have both been hospitalized, nothing has changed.
So I wait for that bad thing to happen. I'm so sorry you are facing this but I can say that this website has offered me wisdom and a sense that someone cares. I am thankful I found it.
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In home care is the best option for her. She actually is wise to be a little suspicious. So many elderly trust their families to help them and then are betrayed by them. Throwing them into nursing homes and taking away EVERYTHING they own. Leaving them trapped and alone with people who are often abusive in this facilities. I have seen it myself.

There are programs that can help provide the funding needed for caregivers to come into her home (including family). They can also help pay for anything she needs to help her that is not covered by her insurance. The one we have here is called IRIS. Every state should have something similar. You don't need power of attorney to help her with food shopping or bills. You just need her permission and have involved in doing it with you.
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Call 911 and request a 72 hour hold for a psych evaluation. Call Adult Protective Services to evaluate her living conditions.

If you have trusted relatives that engage with her, ask them to video her when she's angry.

Contact an Elder Law Attorney where she lives and have a virtual meeting. This experience will give you an education on how you plan your end-of-life wishes.

You might want to visit some memory care facilities where she lives AND where you live so you know what is available.
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If you want to get guardianship/conservation of mom, please speak to your family solicitor to take to court and got power of attorney for you to  make decisions about your mom dementia. 
Matilda
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Have doctor come to her or start w video appt.

You may not need a conservatory ship which is expensive and long. If doctor believes she had dimentia but is still with it yo know her family, what a POA, will, trust is, and the consequences of those documents then get doctor to sign short document stating she is able to make own estate planning decisions at this time.

Then have her sign Durable Power to Attorney and elect you as conservator ship and have her specifically give you right to decide her housing. Make it effective either immediately or when two doctors certified her later as unable to care for herself.

This is your best option. Gone are days that dimentia automatically makes a person have to give in assisted living or take all their rights.

Millions of moderate and mild dimentia patients reside in own homes alone so long as not threat to themselves or others and can eat, dress themselves. Who cares the don’t recall dates and who Pres is. They don’t need to. Have meal on wheels come for meals if she needs that.

This set of help is a work arounds to more expensive conservatorship. Good luck.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
This does sound ideal. I only want to help where help is needed. I would like for her to live with me in case things go wrong then I will not be several states away. She does not want that but she does need resources like in home care, light house keeping, help with ADLs, shopping, meals and etc. I need resources on how to get that. She is also not going to let anyone in the home. I have asked her for POA for when that is needed. She doesn't say yes or no. I have asked for access to past her bills and she looks at me crazy. I understand her not wanting to do that. I have been trying to get her to set her bills up for automatic payment but have been unsuccessful. I don't want her to be without food, water, electricity and etc because she will not pay her bills on time. It literally can be an all day ordeal to get one bill paid. Last time we did bills she spent 1.5 hours with her bank to reestablish her password that she claims someone changed. It took her that long to follow the instructions and I was sitting with her and she would not allow me to help.
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I'm sorry to hear what you're going through. Sounds like she needs a complete physical and neurological evaluation. There are no quick answers. But one thing is for sure you have got to do something, before it gets further out of control. Dementia is a progressive disease, it doesn't get better. No one knows what you're going through. All cases are different. Does she qualify for any medical state help? My heart goes out to any caregiver dealing with dementia. You need to gather as much information as possible concerning her finances and start the medical appointments. Time is not on your side. Do as much as you can. She will fight you all the way because no one likes to give up their independence. She doesn't realize yet that you're trying to help her. And for yourself, gather a group of people that you trust and love so they can give you support and maybe help you on your endeavor. Be blessed and move forward.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
She needs a home visit. I cannot get her to leave the house. she had not stepped foot into the front or backyard. She refused to leave the house or go anywhere.
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There our companies that put together the forms for conservative ship and guardianship. They sent out a questionnaire which I mailed back. They put the paperwork together and I paid around $400. But it was worth it because they'll put the paperwork together for you. and walk you through the process including Court. I was assigned and advisor from beginning to end. Filed the documents and set a court date. The court assigned an attorney for my father-in-law . We met with the attorney at his office to get acquainted. We went to court. The judge had already been given the papers, he signed the papers and I was out the door. We paid the attorney and that was all. It took 30 days.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
You just gave me a ray of hope. What should I enter into a Google search for this type of company?
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tluck8: Perhaps you'll have to contact Adult Protective Services.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
I have tried them twice to no avail.
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Can you reason with the family members that have control? They must want to have her elsewhere.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
There is no family member in control. I am her sole surviving child. I only have a cousin in my extended family on my mother's side. He is the son of my mother's sister who passed away. I also have my 21 year old nephew. He is my brother's son who passed away. I do have an uncle but he lives in another state. I am the one who has to step up and make sure my mother gets the care she deserves.
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I suggest you report your mom to Adult Protective Services. If they make a visit and observe what you are saying they may be helpful in getting her into a facility. It’s also possible that she has a medical condition that is undiagnosed. There are doctors that will visit the home and online medical services available as well.
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tluck8 Apr 2023
I have made two calls and she has had two visits by APS. The second visit I was present. She is alert and oriented to person, place and time. I called for self neglect. They established her nutrition is lacking. She admitted to only eating yogurt and pudding. She has several chronic conditions and not taking her medications. They got confirmation she has lost more than 70 lbs in the last year and that she had difficulties with her bills. The social worker told me he/ they were not the appropriate entity and to try mental health. I don't believe he wanted to do his job.
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Tkuck I'm sorry to hear just read your situation.
Elder Law can be an assistant.
Area fir Aging Agency excellent
Yiu might have to have her unfit, fir her safety court.
Telephone her PCP that was a great assistance / only takes two doctors signature. If she wouldn't go to doctors they will send Agency Contact to elevate her right there in home
Respectfully
Brown Sugar Pittsburgh,Pa
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tluck8 Apr 2023
Thank you for your reply. I will try her doctor's office again. The last time I attempted to speak with her doctor the office manager or nurse was very rude. She spoke over me, cut me off and kept denying me access to the doctor citing HIPAA. I understand HIPAA so expressing my concerns to the doctor should not be a violation.
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